Elderly Tax Relief
The public hearing is tonight at 7:30pm in Town Hall. Please remind your friends and family about this important public hearing.
Blogging on Cheshire, Connecticut USA To see a particular topic, click on the categories to the left.
Me in Haiti
Interesting sites
- CT Curmudgeon
- CT Capitol Report
- Cheshire Patch
- Tony Perugini Listens
- Underground Town Hall
- Cheshire Herald
- Meriden R-J
- New Haven Register
- CT Mirror
- CT News Junkie
- Politico
- Huffington Post
- Bloomberg News
- Campaign for Liberty
- Rasmussen Reports
- CT Political Reporter
- NYTimes
- CT Sunlight
- Waterbury Rep-Am
- My Left Nutmeg
- Ironman on DC
- Dennis House
- Sarah French
- MRJs community blogs
- Power to the People
- Dowd Muska
- Make Blue Red
- Levers and Pulleys
- Friends of Boulder Knoll
- Courant Capitol Watch
- Shelly Sindland
- Every Day Republican
- CT Energy
- New Haven Independent
- Nick Ragone
2012 candidates
Followers
2009 Candidate websites
Send LTTEs!
- letters@courant.com
- letters@nhregister.com
- letters@record-journal.com
- news@cheshireherald.com
- opinion@rep-am.com
Categories
- taxes n spending (891)
- community (435)
- energy (411)
- recreation (358)
- money (334)
- schools (325)
- town government (266)
- state government (248)
- 2010 election (216)
- Ron Paul (208)
- public works (202)
- environment (195)
- 2008 election (187)
- politics (175)
- federal government (173)
- public safety (173)
- council mtg (165)
- history (155)
- good government (142)
- employees (136)
- northend development (135)
- jobs (124)
- legislators (113)
- truthiness (112)
- Haiti (106)
- 2009 election (102)
- transportation (90)
- foreign affairs (74)
- open forum (70)
- war (69)
- blog (49)
- healthcare (46)
- council video (39)
- housing (37)
- underage drinking (32)
- veterans (29)
- 2007 election (28)
- Iraq (27)
- seniors (26)
- town manager (23)
- 2012 election (20)
- pool (15)
- travel (14)
- Cheshire elections (13)
- 2011 election (7)
- Charter revision (5)
Local websites
Council emails
- tslocum@snet.net
- dsschrumm@cox.net
- tomruocco@snet.net
- aafalvey@cox.net
- timwhite98@yahoo.com
- giddingsanne@yahoo.com
- michaele584@aol.com
Cheshire sports
Blog Archive
-
▼
2007
(738)
-
▼
March
(104)
- Cow farts
- Recalling local elected officials
- BOE poll
- State Rep. Nardello's bills (part I)
- 1/2 million dollars
- Budget workshop 3/28
- Prop 2 1/2 in CT
- Pool consultant update
- Budget workshop 3/27
- Underage drinking efforts
- No fuel cells
- Budget workshop 3/26
- Cost of impact study
- Senator Gaffey's bills (part IV)
- Electric reform
- Monday meetings
- School drug testing
- Clinton Crossing
- Legislative payraise
- CT Prop 2 1/2
- Senator Gaffey (part III)
- The Medal of Honor
- ESCO defined
- Senator Gaffey (part II)
- Storm drains to nowhere
- Budget mtg 3/22
- Chamber legislative breakfast
- Senator Gaffey's bills
- Budget mtg 3/21
- Meetings
- 07/08 Budget PH 3/20
- Strathmore dam
- Avoiding sewers
- Biodiesel factory
- Video working?
- Open forum 3/20
- Council update
- Death of the spending cap
- Sen. Caligiuri's bills (part II)
- Cuts to PILOT
- Adding video
- Testing video
- Perks for legislators
- Southington smartboards
- Sen. Sam Caligiuri
- Ideal community
- Conflicts of interest
- New drug from Alexion
- "We're following this application"
- War vs. environment
- Citing references
- Uncle Al's bills
- Open forum 3/15
- I just pay it because I need it
- Council poll
- Budget workshop 3/14
- Mary's bills (III)
- Westfield opposition
- Council mtg 3/13
- ND public hearing
- ETR tomorrow
- Open forum 3/12
- Sewer help
- The big time!
- So many "Dunkin'"
- Building green
- The White House
- Council agenda 3/13
- 07/08 Budget
- Thumbs up!
- Madison zone change
- Questions for ND
- Richard Chevrolet expansion
- Some thoughts on ETR
- Schrumm vs. Miller
- Mary's bills (part II)
- Mary's bills
- Constitution in Cheshire
- The problem with ETR
- Electricity reform
- Milone & MacBroom
- The funnies (part III)
- Public hearing recap
- Elderly Tax Relief
- The funnies (part II)
- Water stays, but money disappears
- Playground bill
- The funnies (part I)
- Boulder Knoll
- My dad on America
- Retail vs. manufacturing
- P&Z public hearing
- ESCOs in Cheshire
- ND stirs people to action
- RTC on state budget
- Community meetings
- Cheshire in NYC
- North Haven development
- Blue Back Q & A
- NHR on ND
-
▼
March
(104)
41 comments:
Tim - I think that the proposal stinks, more could have been done. We deserve more and we will fight for more. I want Al's proposal that seniors that make $90k should get relief. We have paid a lot in and now we deserve a break, not this joke.
Tim I disagree...if you have 90k income as a senior you dont need relief...I will say that for those in lower income brackets( 13-25k) should get a break,,,I do not think putting a lein on their home is right though...if they get a break give them the break...what older person wants a lein on their home when they die..if I could make the meeting(out of town) I would address the lein issue...
Why should have to pay for this education system that is out of control? Teachers making $80k and others making over $100k, I have to pay for that? Stop....
Did you complain when the town gave the late Police chief a full pension? we all are paying for that times 2 with the other chief passing away...
That too... I have paid enough.
lien I think is the word here.
As long as I don't have to pay.
First off, no one in town earning $90,000 deserves a tax break if the rest of us are not getting one. No way, no how.
Second to the anonymous commenter who complained about teaches earning $80,000, Do you have any idea what it takes to raise a family these days while paying for a mortgage and taxes and so forth. These people eanr masters degrees and put in alot fo time, effort,care and money of their own to get to that level. They deserved it......
What you deserve a tax break becuase you no longer have kids in school....I dont think so.
There are no Cheshire teachers who earn a base salary of 80,000 unless they have a PHD and more than 15 years experience. I doubt that there is anyone working in Cheshire who fits that mode, top teacher with 6th year degree makes about 78K which means over 15 years experience. So stop with the spreading of more misinformation. And what does this have to do with senior tax relief, More CAVE men tactics to try to divert the attention away from the real issue.
4:26 please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the salary level of Cheshire teachers could be fairly described as this:
There are people who teach in Cheshire who are paid in excess of $90,000 by the BOE (last I checked there were six or seven such teachers... all of whom had taught in excess of 30 years). However, none of them are paid $90k for teaching. Rather, they earn about $78k for teaching and another $10-15k for various other "jobs," such as coaching or heading a dept.
When I sell my house you will have more kids to educate. We deserve a break because we are keeping kids out of the schools and we are not using services. Al had it right, seniors up to $90k or $75k at least.
Tim
AT most you could earn about 8k for football which would be the most. Dept head stipend is not even that much 5k. If someone coached 2 "average" sports and was on top step maybe they could not earn much more than maybe 88k. But very few are in that group. AD gets a stipend of 9K and fall play director gets about 2k for example.
So again all this talk makes it seems like everyone earns 90k gets thrown out there like truth when it is far from it. and what does this have to do with senior tax?
If Seniors earning $75K plus get tax relief, than my family of four, with no children in school at this time, deserve tax relief as well. Sorry, but they dont deserve special treatment....
Leave the teachers out of this discussion. And 3:20 - I don't see a post here that says, "I don't want to pay taxes because my kids are not in the schools." I don't know where you get that. Regardless what elderly tax credit proposal gets passed, the seniors will still be contributing to your kids education - don't worry (and no, I'm not a senior or a teacher).
I just watched most of tonight's meeting and was disappointed to learn that the many proposals the committee had were not considered or discussed at any great length. It seems the ordinance review committee was the one calling the shots based on the town's budget and what would be allowable - not based on the true needs of the seniors.
Also, I agree that the lien idea is bad - no other town imposes a lien and the tax accessor said it defeats the purpose of a credit.
Sounds like this proposal still needs some amending. I hope the council members will do just that.
Tim, can you give an example of how this proposed credit would work? How much additional credit would a senior get?
Could the town reduce any expenses to help cover a part of this credit so that all those that complain about even giving the seniors a credit might stop their moaning (at least maybe they'll stop moaning a little while in between their running to meetings trying to get the turf field passed or the meetings to get the "high end" stores built - you know, the stores that most seniors probably won't even be able to afford).
I watched the hearing on TV tonight and it was almost funny to hear Kunde make a fool of himself. The man is a joke and should just try to not make public statements where is opens himself up to be mocked and cruelly admonished. But I guess some kind of like to be the center of attention even when they are acting very foolish.
9:22 "Tim, can you give an example of how this proposed credit would work? How much additional credit would a senior get?"
please see my post "public hearing recap" and click on the two pages. You should see the details there of the proposed tax credit increases.
Wow what a joke last night. The income limit is $47k, too low, and only reduction of $250. Seniors build this town and we deserve more. We should not have to pay for the town's over-spending on education and other things like the pool. I think that a freeze in not enough, it should be a roll back to tax levels of 5 years ago.
Kunde for council he has good ideas and is very well spoken. He has my vote.
Mr. Kunde has a knack for making pronouncements on subjects - a smarter-than-thou air - that probably wouldn't sit too well with the electorate in a campaign.
Saying the seniors deserve some additional tax relief is one thing, but you can't just ignore what impact such measures might have on the town's budget.
His closing remarks - about voter backlash in November - were priceless (not!). Instead of saying the voters will react to the council's handling of the senior tax relief issue, he should step up and run himself if he's so convinced of what he is saying.
That said, I just don't see him stepping away from the safety of the sidelines -where he is free to criticize without having to come up with any ideas of his own - to actually take the risks that are involved in governing.
He also tends to get a tad too testy when the council - and other governing bodies - don't properly fawn over the suggestions of the energy commission.
Anonymous 9:14 a.m.:
Be careful, your sense of entitlement is showing. I think there is an intersting double standard on this blog that it's okay to say certain interst groups (sports and band parents immediately come to mind) have a sense of entitlement and are responsible for the town's financial situation, but those seniors who aren't satisfied with what is being offered get a free pass.
Rightly or wrongly, in this day and age nobody "deserves more." You don't like what the council is doing regarding tax relief, run for council yourself or back others with similar views. Get involved and stay committed; last night's lack of seniors at the hearing was absurd. How many people can actually be disatisfied with this sort of thing if you get fewer than a dozen people over 65 to a hearing on the subject. I could understand if there was a lot of snow and ice on the ground, but not having a large turnout because of the cold makes you question whether this issue isn't being driven by the few rather than the many.
What is most interesting is the fact there is 21 comments on the hearing last night-however only 4 people spoke.Why didn't you step up to the plate and give your opinion where it counts?
Bob - Great point, it would lead you to believe that the only people who really care were in the room and the public could careless.
Anon, 10:29 am
Thanks for the criticism and input. I am aware of the impact on the budget and how a reduction in taxes may affect the rest of the budget. My issue was the process did not allow for an analysis that would determine a fair amount of tax relief we could afford.
I did submit several solutions/ideas for the tax relief committe to review, along with other people and the committe choose not to review them.
Your comment about the Energy Commission is interesting, the only item I voted against was the fuel cells for the pool. My work on the commission along with all of the other members is to bring energy savings ideas to the Town. How the governing officials act on them is up to the officials. I ask that you tell me what energy idea the commission had that the Town did not fawn over, that would be valuable input.
As to the lack of participation at the Senior Tax Relief Council meeting Tuesday. Most seniors knew this meeting was useless as far as making any changes to the proposal. At the Ordinance Meetings and the Tax Reflief committee meetings the room was packed with seniors. The other point I would like to make was at the first meeting of the Senior Tax Relief committee it was suggested that a meeting be held at the senior center during the day. Eveyone said nice idea - did it happen - no. Many seniors are afraid or unable to drive at night. Some consideration would have been nice.
People fail to realize that keeping seniors in their homes is a cost savings to the town. The total program cost last year was $357,000 (budgeted amount $395,000) in a total town budget of approx 90M. What are we concerned about? This is a small price to pay for the dignity and well being of our long time residents.
The seniors not only failed to show up, I understand it was night, cold, etc. I have not seen letters in the paper, except from the few who do show up, or any form of communication. One could conclude that it is something being pushed by a few.
From what I understand there were over 3,000 signatures collected on petitions for senior tax relief. That shows tremendous support - we can't even get that many residents to show up for midterm elections. Also were talking about people who are in their 70's, 80's, and 90's they're not going to be vocal like other groups it's something most of them are not comfortable with.
Did the people that signed know that the program would cost over $300,000? Was the impact included? Did they read it? My guess is they had no idea.
Look at the vote in Southington, I am not sure that it would be much different here. I think it would be a great idea to send out and let the public decide.
As someone who collected 100's of signatures I would like to respond to 12:02 and 12:06. The object of the petition was to go to referendum, when it was submitted the town attorney stated it was not legal - so no referendum. To answer the question regarding if people knew the costs of the existing program, the answer is yes. Most people I talked to felt this was the right thing to do for our seniors. They also had the common sense to realize that keeping seniors in their homes utimately is a savings not an expenditure. But let me say the existing program is less than 1/2 of 1% of the total town budget. Give me a break, this is not going to greatly impact our budget by any means. One elderly woman said to me "where I am, you will someday be" maybe we should all take these words into consideration.
Why did the republicans not take the lead and grow this program when they had the chance? It had the smallest increases in funding during their years? Why? Why was Steve C. not pushing this? Why does he push it now? This program only grows when the Dems do it. Hall oversaw the biggest increase in the history of the program. Are the republicans playing politics with this issue?
Nice job Marion....good luck...40 yrs old , 1 kid in school...and willing to pay a little more to help out seniors...the lien aspect isnt right though..no liens...
Tim...no liens...would your mom and dad want a tax break that puts a lien on there house? I doubt it....
This issue is neither Rep. or Dem. it's coming together to do what is best for all citizens of Cheshire. But if you want to throw stones when Dave Orsini proposed increasing the upper limits of the program last year, which would have totaled a whopping $6,000 extra to the program, Diane Visconti said she couldn't approve the expenditure because "she didn't know where the money would come from". All the Dem's ultimately voted against the proposal. Then a couple of months later the Dems. OK'd $10,000 for fireworks with no problem (where did they find the money). The formation of the Senior Tax Relief Committee was suggested by Tom Ruocco - a Republican. So let's not put all the problems on the backs of the Republicans. PLEASE! The Democrats ran in the last election on senior property tax relief and produced nothing. It took a petition to make them realize that they better get moving or they would be moving out.
Buying votes is never right.
People can make all the excuses for the lack of seniors at Tuesday's hearing that they want, but the fact is that the only that politicians understand is a show of force, a strong turnout. And it has to be consistent, not just when it's convenient.
It's really easy to sign a petition or rail against the school budget anonymously on this blog, but if you really believe in something, you've got to fight for it.
That is what people of this same generation did when faced with the Axis threat of WWII. I know that such a comparison is a little over the top, but I think sometimes we sell the resourcefulness of senior citizens short. Maybe a night time bus from the Senior Center could have been arragened for those who are afraid to drive.
Just as some folks contend that holding a public hearing at night isn't fair to seniors, holding a meeting during the day at the Senior Center wouldn't be fair to those who have to work or have family commitments. It would be like stacking the deck on this particular issue; the council wouldn't get a clear view of where people stand. And God forbid if anyone who showed up at a Senior Center hearing didn't completely agree with the dogma of the majority.
One thing that nobody who supports a freeze ever talks about is that even if these folks got the freeze they were asking for, they'd still be able to influence town politics tremendously via the ballot box.
What is to stop folks who've gotten the freeze from turning around and negatively influencing the board of education budget? That wouldn't be fair, either
I know we can't vote for the schools budget like some states where the town meeting form of government is used in certain communities. But showing up at town meetings in large numbers is hugely influential.
Steve Carroll called it a "moral" issue that seniors get tax relief. But when he has chair of the Ord. committee he did NOTHING on the issue. Now he is saying we did not do enough. Give me a break-when he was under the control of Shrumm he said not a word. Now he sees where this issue can go. To late the Democrats did something real about the issue and left the Republicans in the dust.
You people that continue to criticize others by name are cowardly and juvenile. Grow up! I'm glad the republicans are not slinging mud. Shame on those of you who are. Dirty politics if you ask me.
Carroll said it at a council meeting when the issue of senior tax came up. Maybe about 2-3 months ago. Check the record cuz he said it!
1:31 With regard to elderly tax relief increases being more significant with dem majorities, rather than with republican majorities... I do seem to recall that, but have no numbers to substantiate it. Can you provide some numbers? I'm sure town hall has the numbers. Whatever it is, i think it could add to the discussion.
9:55... I must've been at that Council meeting, but really don't recall that comment. Can you add a link to the minutes?
To everyone... if you can cite references to support your assertions, I suspect your comments will carry more weight. But without references, it's hard to not take some "factual" comments with a grain of salt.
Post a Comment