Emergency mtg 5/14
I think this was our third emergency meeting in less than two weeks. Much of the discussion was held in executive session. The Herald was there though for the vote, so there'll probably be an article in this week or next.
Anyway, we voted on a resolution related to the situation in the north end of town... the culvert/tunnel/aqueduct situation. The motion passed 6-2 (Schrumm, White opposed; Visconti not present for executive session, so she did not vote).
I explained my view on the situation as dualfold:
1) the emergency excavation aspect (which I supported two weeks ago)
2) who pays for it?
I strongly supported taking action two weeks ago because of the emergency nature of the situation. However, I opposed the action tonight because I felt it was essentially a vote for this $530,000 project to be fully funded by government. And as I said before... with rights (to develop land) come responsibilities (to protect land). The owners of the property should be paying for at least a portion of this project.
Tim White
Town Council, 4th District
77 comments:
tim-you seem to be getting way off the line with many of your recent votes. This one is an example. If you think for a min, if we just leave it up the land owners they would do nothing, then someone would have to step in and that would be the govt. Private owners have no incentive-and then what-a flood on my property-you have gone off the deep end on this one and have lost my vote-plain and simple. Start thinking about the people and dump this "my philo" crap-it does not work for me
We are local, state and federal taxpayers and as such we get stuck with the bill? The all get the money from us. What's wrong with the council people who voted for it. Fully paid for by taxpayers?
It should be fully paid for by the owners, Boman, Calcagni and the other guy whoever he is. We keep hearing what nice people they are, really? Doug Calcagni donated $1,200. Not bad to get $530,000 in return.
Executive session? Why can't the taxpayers hear the arguments for and against.
This is only the start of taxpayers donations to the wealthy of this money making project.
Who's idea was it?
Get the tar and feathers.
Can we have a breakdown of what our $530,000 is going to be spent on and who is being paid what. Who's giving out the contract, is it being bid on, who's managing it. Are Bowman, Calcagni, Milone and McBroom, W/S and Fazzone getting any of the money?
Let's have the minutes made public.
7:42
white said he voted to fix the problem. white did NOT vote to PAY for the fix. the developers shou.ld pay.
good on white for having backbone and "thinking about the people"m not the developrs.
whites not my favoirte, but he makes sense on this.
"Let's have the minutes made public."
Does anyone know who to call for that?
Speaking of responsibility, didn't the owners have a responsibility to keep up the culvert in the first place? There was an awful lot of rain, but I'm betting that very little upkeep was done prior to the flood. This property has never been just another vacant lot to be flipped.
I'm all for disaster relief, but I think there might be a case for negligence here -- if there was a healthy earth pack up top, a strong tunnel ceiling, and a minimum of up-river debris this probably wouldn't have happened (no?). We have absentee land-owners letting the property fall while we the people pick up the tab. Worse off, they stand to make money off the deal as the property will probably be all the more suitable for easy development after the excavation.
Just build it, who cares?
"Can we have a breakdown of what our $530,000 is going to be spent on and who is being paid what. Who's giving out the contract, is it being bid on, who's managing it. Are Bowman, Calcagni, Milone and McBroom, W/S and Fazzone getting any of the money?
Let's have the minutes made public."
As usual, they'll be available. I just made a call, and right now they have yet to be typed-up. They'll probably be ready in a few days, but I think they have up to a week (?) to make them available.
"Just build it, who cares? "
You must have a financial interest.
Taxpayers care when they get screwed and this is just the start. This council just doesn't care about us, we don't have the right name.
You won't get any minutes that matter, they don't take them in executive session. I think that this whole thing is a hoax to start clearing the property with out having to get approvals. Once the proerty is dug no one will care if it is built.
We should fire the council and the town manager and elect tim as mayor.
Will my taxes go down if the money is not given to the developers? Of course not. The feds are paying for about 75% of this project a lot of money yes, when compared to the war that we are fighting, it is change, when compared to the way the Presdient has spent money, it is nothing. It is a waste of time to write about it.
No our taxes will never go down but we can have a say on how they are spent. Let your voices be heard. It's our right. If we never question things how are we different than other nation?
Anyone know what things would look like post-cleanup? What a great scenario for the money-makers.
a. let the historical site/environmental hazard go to hell
b. a storm comes along and breaks the camels back
c. outside money is piped in to 'fix' and probably erase the culvert/historical site
d. property is now history free and prepared for paving
Either way, just apply the old quandry-solver. Cui bono? Who benefits?
Tim, you were there. What will the cleanup look like? Also, thanks for voting 'No.'
our voices should not be heard.
the democrats know that 100 new kisd in the schools is good.
we subract 60 jids and add 4 news teachers. if we add 100 kids, how mahy new teaches do we need.
the democrats do what the developers tell them.
the develocrats are smarter then us.
This has been a problem for more than 25 years. Why the rush to fix it now? I ask again, why now? Real honest answers are needed period. Someone knows and they should divulge it. The citizens have a right to this information now that their money is being spent on land that is owned by the LLC.
Matt Bowman is pulling down opposition flyers. Tell everyone you know to make lawn signs and any other type of sign you can think of.
Are we going to stand up these developers or let them rename the town to Bowmanville or Calcagniville or Queenville or Glotzville.
Anon 1:25 You are in another world. Your goung to be old by the time this is built. Think about it . The word starts with "C" and end in "T". Enjoy your dream.
You would hope that if we were going to waste $530,000, in Federal and State money, at least we could have gotten something we need like turf.
3:25 You must be dreaming the same dream 1:25 has...lol
?You would hope that if we were going to waste $530,000, in Federal and State money, at least we could have gotten something we need like turf.
Well, I hope the land-owner(s) enjoy the free excavation. I suppose it's part of our welfare for the wealthy program.
Oh, by the way. If you have an emergency like this for a historical site, shouldn't it be A RESTORATION and not an excavation? Isn't the money to be spent on fixing the storm damage? That should mean _restoring_ the culvert.
Tim, what exactly will be done to the area with state/fed funds?
They are building a by-pass around the culvert. The land owner has to fix the culvert over the next few months.
The paper was not wrong. There are other owners of the front parcel. Remember there is 80 acres plus 20+ on the RT 10 side. The 10 mile river divides the two.
The precedent has been established, if you have a problem on your land call the town. To have these discussions in executive session only makes people think things are funny. The truth needs to come out. This smells of wrongdoing.
The one issue no one seems to want to address is what is going to happen with the 2 mil worth of fine sand in the area. Is it going to be removed? If so who is being sold to? What will replace it? If the structure is to be rebuilt why remove the sand...other than for monetary gain?
I can't wait to read the Cheshire Herald's take on this. I'm sure they will say that having the taxpayers pay and not the owners is a win win and congratulate the council for taking bold heroic action. If they want to be a community paper, then they should not always take the developers side. Yes, the 400 acres of stores and residences would provide more advertising dollars, but without readers you can't sell realty or store ads.
"Smells of corruption. As a Democrat, I'm damn mad and will not vote for any local Democrat in the future. I will change to an independent"
No. Instead, we need to gather together and take back the local democratic party. The development will probably be railroaded through, but there's going to be a changing of the old guard this upcoming cycle.
Of course, the dems in town might still stick up for the people. Unfortunately, they've grown too used to the idea that they're 'the people.'
The other issue forgotten in all of this mess is what options on the land are available to who, when the zone text change goes through? Simply stated, people (potential buyers) have options to buy this land from the official record of owner of the property today. When it appears the development will go through those options to purchase the land will be exercised, then the new owners will sell the land to the new development company.
You all seem so concerned with what is going on with the North End development and you believe that the communities best interest should be put first. Even pefore the problems on the land, so many of you wanted this private property to be treated like a commonwealth. Which I neither agree or disagree. Yet once the problem arouse and the "community"/taxes would contribute to the restoration you want nothing to do with it and throw back the "private property" argument. You all need to pick a side and stop speaking out of both sides of your mouths.
"Yet once the problem arouse and the "community"/taxes would contribute to the restoration you want nothing to do with it and throw back the "private property" argument."
The owners are petitioning the town in order to rig the rules of the game so they can fatten their assets. That's strike one. They're also doing this to the detriment of the town. That's two. And, now, there's funds en route that'll further their ongoing adventure in croney capitalism. The damage may even be the result of neglect. I'm not sure if that's a foul or a ball or strike, but I think we'll find out in time.
I for one would be fine with federal/state (even town) funds going to fix up that property IF it the site weren't about to be flipped for 400 acres of pavement and manicured greenery.
Let's not lose the context here. We're about to get screwed.
---------
On another note, what about the properties near the proposed site?
Do we know that the p&z and council folks don't stand to cash in directly from the increased traffic? Rt. 10 traffic from the prison to the north-end has always been a bit lighter. There are businesses all along there, but there's also a lot of room for devlopment. I'd be shocked if there aren't any conlficts of interests to consider. So, who owns property in the north end of town along rt. 10?
If the text change is passed, you can expect one of the following scenarios:
Scenario 1:
W/S will after some time goes by, not much, will say they are having trouble getting some stores that would be very advantageous because of the size limitation and that they need at least nnn,nnn sq ft. and heights of nnn. If P&Z say no, then W/S says they will have to pull out. P&Z know that if they pull out, the local owners can build housing on the entire 109 acres. To avoid the embarrasment of the entire property burdening the town with all that housing the P&Z will agree to that and anything else W/S wants. The result, Big Box stores.
Senario 2
With housing hitting a new low, banks tightening lending practices, realestate values falling, a slowing economy, consumer sales falling, gas hitting an all-time high, the dollar hitting a new low making imports more expensive, and as a result of these factors there is a reluctance of national chain to expand in areas of high competition. So, if W/S has trouble getting lessors, they might well bail out, leaving the current land owner/developers the ability to build rental on the entire 109 acres. And, rental is easier to do since renters only have to put down a security payment. There are many parents in the surrounding towns that would like to get their kids into Cheshire schools.
In either of these scenarios Cheshire will lose. And, remember the text change is for 400 acres and once changed, you can't go back.
the culvert/tunnel/aqueduct is not being touched in the current project. Rather a bypass is being excavated.
Tell me if I am wrong did Republicans vote for this too? Do you think that the whole council is currupt?
Let's get back to basics here-we need the north end and WS. All in town want it the council wants it and the P and Z wants it and its going to happen.
Get with it old timer
WS gonna get it done for ya'all
Big stores and more
Go for it like never before
ERTTTT Get them cows in the barn
The booys from WS are gonna cook up something niccccce...
just like you don't like it old timer
Put the chickens in the coop
The boys are back the boys are back
Yea all i want to do is talk about the north end-good stuff and more of it
Love the bowman and cal and all the developers they have the towns best interests at heart
Get off the fence older man
hit with a pick shovel
Bang-wow what was that/
Big WS movement in town
Gonnna give ya somein niccccceee
just like I pictured it
Big town get big stores
MAybe a Wallmart
Or Lowes
Or even a KMart
"All in town want it the council wants it and the P and Z wants it "
How do you know P&Z wants it? You make it sound like a done deal.
it is get used to it
I have inside secret information that there will be a decision reached at the next PZ meeting-WS and the boys have it in the bag!!!!!!!!111
i heard the same thing-gonna happen don't worry about anything
i know too
The more you respond to posts like 12:04 the more they are going to write their little haiku's, poems, verbal garbage or whatever they wish to call them. Just ignore their comments. It's not in the bag. They are just trying to get us all worked up and make us think all is corrupt. There has been no vote and no final decision on the zone change. We elected these people and have to stand by their votes and what they decide. Its funny how we vote them into office and then when we don't get what we want, don't see eye to eye into the future with them, we get mad and even threaten them. Maybe we should question ourselves next time we vote rather than question those WE voted into office. We as a community put them there and maybe we as a community shouldn't soley blame them. The easiest thing to do is to point the finger at someone else rather than yourself. At first I was against it all but maybe we can't see something in the future that they see as a group. Maybe it is in the best interest of the future of our town, not necessarily the immediate future, and maybe we dont want it but what about the future of our world. I'm talking about our children, the most people of the future.
Maybe we should pull together as a town and request specific things of this development from W/S ****IF it is passed*** to make sure it is adding something special and uniique to our community. I have a feeling they will listen if we aren't just spitting fire rather if we ask something of them. Lets set a bar for them to have to reach and tell them we are expecting and trusting them to come up with something absolutely unique to this community. Its just a thought. People do listen if you speak to them as people not as evil or enemies.
Answer to 16:00 PM
"I have a feeling they, W/S, will listen if we aren't just spitting fire rather if we ask something of them........."
Listen yes, do no.
They are the 500 lb gorilla and they do what they want to do. They did what they wanted in Canton. They like big box and have done a lot of business with them, Walmart, Kmart, Target, Home Depot, Lowes...........
And, they have nothing to say about the other 300 acres.
This is the main thing
WS gonna be ya neighbor
Ya gonna like em
Its in the bag and the die is cast
Big changes
Good changes
Be ready stores on the way
Toot Toot
Gotcha
the shoppes at cheshire
Now that is the idea of a lifetime
We all support it and the PZ will vote yes-that is a sure thing
RUSH, RUSH, RUSH.
Emergency meeting, closed door executive session?
Today's, May 16, Record Journal says, Milone told the the council any delay in signing the funding agreement with Tristar, Doug Calcagni and Paul Bowman could jeopardize the federal funds.
So, the council jumped to action and approved the reimbursement agreement on Monday. Done deal? No. As of Weds. night Tristar, Calcagn and Bowman, had not signed the agreement. Their attorney Lawrence J. Greenberg did not return the Record-Journals call for comment.
Why wasn't it signed by Tristar, Bowman and Calcagni, Monday night???????????????????????????????????????????????????
Huh?
" and you must be dum! "
Learn how to spell dumb before you use the word. And, you should know that you capitalize names. Now, go sit in the corner and put your hat back on.
Dave Schrumm loves this town and that's why he voted against the mall.He doesn't want to see Cheshire paved over and become just another part of Queen Street.
anon 5/6 2:16 I agree with much of what you said but the cart is before the horse. W/s has misinformed us twice. (1) There were no plans and they turned up the next day. (2) they don't need the residential and now they pressing for it (condo's to garden apts to apts. The story seems to change often and this is at their best behavior. What did they do to Canton? Check it out. Look at the units going up in Mt Carmel on RT 10 after the Quinnipiac river (huge 3 story clusters) This is what might happen on the whole 400 acres. That's not my vision of Cheshire.
Dave Schrumm loves himself and has not been a postitive force on the council or in town at all. He makes up the facts as he goes along and has changed his position on almost everything issue wise
So everyone knows... tonight, I deleted several more comments in this thread.
When you "anonymously" suggest (or outright accuse) someone of being involved in corruption... it's gonna be deleted.
I wish I could stay on top of it in a more timely manner, but just don't have the time.
Tim that is not fair. People on this blog attack everyone without facts and now when someone pushes back you delete it? They write about peoples special interest without any evidence, they say WS will do this or that with proof and they spread lies about people and name people and state it as fact when no one is really sure.
To attack Bowman and Calcagni, by name, when it is not known who actually ownes the land, to attack why they might be doing something without fact and to question if people actually care about Cheshire is wrong.
If you are going to delete what you did you should delete every name and everything written that is not known to be true.
I CANT WAIT FOR THE NEW STORES AND SHOPPES
WE WILL BE VERY HAPPY WITH THEM
Why is Matt Bowman tearing down flyers opposing the W/S mall that is proposed on 109 acres of the interchange that his brother Paul Bowman and Doug Calcagni own with a third party under the LLC name Tristar?
After the last P&Z meeting on the Interchange text change, Matt Bowman, a Democrat, a prior Town Councilor, and currently the chairman of the streetscape committee, gleefully held up a handful of opposition flyers and proclaimed that he personally tore them down.
Does the Democratic Party condone the tearing down of opposition signs and flyers? Are they going to pull down opponent's signs in the upcoming elections?
The Democratic leadership should tell Matt and anyone else working with him to apologize to the community and to stop right now.
It's hard to believe that a town council person would stoop to this level.
Matt never served on the Council. Tim these people lie to make their points and we should take this off the blog.
Is it legal to post notices on telephone poles? No. Therefore the people who are breaking the law should apologize to the people of Cheshire for their illegal acts. And we should thank Matt for taking them down.
I plan on tearing down all the signs that are against the north end. Sometimes I drive from one end of town to the other and see how many I can find. Then I use them for building a very big fire. That fire represents how much I love the north end. My record is 75 in one night. I am going to do that until I get them alll
Happy man and Happy here signing off
Should the people putting up these signs face arrest? Yes, this is a hazard and some could get hurt.
Arrest all the people that put up tag sale, lost cats and dogs signs. This is very child like. Someone has nothing better to do than take down signs. He/she can get hurt taking them down. How sad.
Fact: There is a Matt Bowman on the Cheshire INLAND WETLAND & WATERCOURSE COMMISSION.
Anon 1:54 Why don't you save time and gas and just make copies for your fire. What are you afraid of? Rain.
"Emergency mtg 5/16". I have a few trees down because of rain and high winds. Will the town come and clear them away? Public safety. They have my permission. Keep the wood. Send the bill to "UNCLE SAM". THANKS
9:10 I very much want to be fair. So as I've said in the past... if you have any particular comments that you feel should be deleted, please mention it and I'll certainly consider deleting it.
At this point, there's so many comments, I can't keep up with everything and do miss comments... so I'm counting on everyone here to draw my attention to the inappropriate comments.
As for the names of the owners of much discussed north end property, two names were reported in the NHR about two weeks ago.
I'm not sure where that originated, but I trust the press to get their facts correct and double checked before going to press.
12:53 I agree. I'm virtually certain that Matt Bowman has never served on the Council.
As well, I'm not sure if it's illegal to hang flyers on telephone polls... but that is what I always heard growing up. So I think it is wrong to do it.
And on last week's bike tour I took down one of the signs... after all, it was for the April 9 (???) meeting... so by last week, it was, IMO, litter. Yet whoever put it up, never took it down. And whether it's legal or not (and I'm pretty sure it is illegal) you should at least go around and take down the signs after they are no longer of significance.
According to a report by "The Greater Waterbury Real Estate Report" : "THE TOWNS OF OXFORD AND CHESHIRE WILL DOMINATE THE REGIONS MARKET FOR NEW INDUSTRIAL CONSTRUCTION DURING THE NEXT TWO YEARS". Why is this not being mentioned. We are a booming distribution hub. Why the heck do we want to change the zone? Look at the recent "Whole Foods" and Napoli Foods" in addition to our old friends Bozzuto's and numerous Bedding wholesalers. No activity in the northend. BS. If this change is made it will deter others and not attract. P&Z should leave it alone.
..."If this change is made it will deter others and not attract. P&Z should leave it alone."
We should wait another 25 years?
Cheshire should not have some limited retail?
Because some people do not like retail they should make the decision for everyone?
The word that I have heard is that Matt Bowman is either running against Tom Rucco or is seeking an at-large seat, so he may give it a try.
I think that he would be good.
Matt Bowman? The same Matt Bowman who faces opposition to the mall by tearing down their flyers and then bragging about it at a P&Z meeting. Can anyone be more juvenile? He shouldn't be elected dog catcher. This is a fine example of what Cheshire wants as their elected officials.
If this town votes M Bowman into any position we are in deep S--T. Someone help us please!!!! He could even become Mayor. Ohh S--T what a thought.
MATT BOWMAN FOR COUNCIL!!!
I think that Matt would be good. He is a great guy once you get to know him.
Ther are many great people in town but many should not be councilman. Ther are many great people in town and should be councilman. There are many councilman who are great people but should not be on the council.
Matt Bowmans' behavior in regards to the NE development is not behavior becomming a councilman.
Anon 10:41 Limited retail? Could be 400 acres worth. This is not just about this imaginary "LSC" which is not even supposed to exist yet. This is about the text change which will add mixed use and residential. Not that simple. It took 25 years because the old developer had problems of some sort. This was not Cheshires fault. This might take another 25 years because of legal issues. For now I have plenty of retail and I will support my local retailers,restaurants etc. which most are owned by local citizens.
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